I am not saying we are different!  What you are posting, JB, underscores my statement: what is it, in opinion of jkash, to Americanize?

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I think "to americanize" may have different meanings depending on what such americanized individual has as a goal, provided, of course that americanization of the individual was voluntary. In my experience, it can have two meanings.

1. A person may choose to fully forget his place of origin and culture because of desperate desire to fit in. These people feel that wherever it is they are from is left behind. They are now in the US and thus are Americans. 

2. A person wants to live his or her life like the rest of the American society without forgetting his or her roots. This person is involved in cultural events and keeps up with former countrymen. The kids are taught values, culture and language of the parents.

As far as the kids in the post are concerned, they are undergoing a type 1 americanization, though involuntary. I am not saying it is good or bad, just that it fits that type. 

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Anybody that comes to America as a child will end up Americanized.  The fact that they go off to school and have American friends will play a bigger impact than the parents hoping to keep them 'foreign'.  And the 2nd generation that grows up 100% American will view their grandparents as 'foreigners with a funny accent'.

It doesn't mean we forget our roots, it just means we are completely assimilated.  Some cultures work VERY hard never to assimilate (native Americans living on the reservation is a good example actually).  But most of us are happy to be Americanized.  By the 2nd or 3rd generation your kids will be complete 'muts' anyway:  I'm part German, part English, part Irish - is it any wonder I'm a war-mongering Imperialist that likes to drink?

What's also interesting is how the classes have mingled - my Dad's side of the family was poor, my mom's side rich.  Dad's side fought in the civil war, Indian war (yep, killing off those native Americans), WWII, & Vietnam.  Mom's side was all lawyers and doctors going back to the early 1800's here. 

What's most amazing is to remember that our country is only around 250 years old, so the culture itself continues to dynamically change with each new wave of new immigrants.  As the Chinese like to say about the 'American experiment':  we are still waiting to see if it's a success or not.

 

 

 

 

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"Hearts will never be practical until they can be made unbreakable."

First, people who live in the 21st century and do not realize the benefits of being bi/tri-cultural frighten me. Second, when the couple began to work on children's rooms is utterly irrelevant; thus, there is no need for senseless assumptions, which in fact speak of one's lack of judgement. Third, regardless of how common it is to change children's names once they are adopted does not make it right. Fourth, 422's ex set a great example for many to follow. And last but not least, the forum's "face" has greatly improved, too bad the same can't be said about some people's "brains."

 P.S. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Those empty-kettled folks who try to Americanize their newly adopted kids do not even realize that they did not just purchase an expensive set of dolls to play with, to dress, to take to Disneyland, and amuse themselves by forever-grateful eyes of poor little orphans and their gaping mouths at the site of toysRus. These orphans are human beings with their own past, feelings, emotions, desires, tastes, likes, dislikes, etc., and they must be respected and treated as such.

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"Some say the Muses are nine: how careless! Look, there's Sappho too, from Lesbos, the tenth." Plato

It's a shame that couple doesn't live here in Atlanta, where we could offer them a Ukranian nanny to keep those children 'bi-cultural'.

lol

Seriously, the flaw in this entire topic starts with the Subject line - the adopting parents are American; of course they are going to "Americanize" their new brats - what else could they possibly do?

It is as adults that we can decide if we want to go to the trouble of involving ourselves in bi-cultural relationships.  Kids are just along for the ride...

 

 

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"Hearts will never be practical until they can be made unbreakable."

Sappho:

Second, when the couple began to work on children's rooms is utterly irrelevant; thus, there is no need for senseless assumptions, which in fact speak of one's lack of judgement. 

So, essentially you are saying that you completely agree with me on the actual issue, but it bothers you to admit that, so you are griping about a small detail of the narrative. 

Don’t worry Sappho, I already know that you secretly worship me and hang on my every word.  There is no need for you to resort to such petty arguments just to try and hide it.

Leah:

So, essentially you are saying that you completely agree with me on the actual issue, but it bothers you to admit that, so you are griping about a small detail of the narrative. 

I am not here to agree or to disagree, I've simply stated my opinion. If it somehow corresponded with yours, then you scored a point or two in my book. As far as griping goes, you did just that by clinching to a minute detail that essentially had absolutely no relevance to the issue.

Leah:

Don’t worry Sappho, I already know that you secretly worship me and hang on my every word.  There is no need for you to resort to such petty arguments just to try and hide it.

As far as I am concerned, there was no argument. As far as petty goes, you couldn't have picked a better word to describe your own comment regarding the preparation of the rooms.

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"Some say the Muses are nine: how careless! Look, there's Sappho too, from Lesbos, the tenth." Plato

James Bond:

Seriously, the flaw in this entire topic starts with the Subject line - the adopting parents are American; of course they are going to "Americanize" their new brats - what else could they possibly do?

I have nothing against raising adopted children as citizens of this country. My point is that poorly educated couples adopting children from abroad do not realize that their new children are not blank slates, but they have their own experiences already, their own identity, their own tastes, etc. Thus, it is important to respect these instead of trying to erase them.

James Bond:

It is as adults that we can decide if we want to go to the trouble of involving ourselves in bi-cultural relationships.  Kids are just along for the ride...

If adults do not want to burden themselves with two cultures, then why adopt kids from abroad?! Adopt kids from the U.S. and make your life easier! I disagree that "kids are just along for the ride." Children are just like adults, only shorter, smaller, and less experienced/knowledgable. Disregarding children's feelings, thoughts, and opinions is irresponsible and, plainly put, stupid. Later on adults pay for the careless mistakes they've made while raising their children, only it's too late.

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"Some say the Muses are nine: how careless! Look, there's Sappho too, from Lesbos, the tenth." Plato

We should meet over a glass of wine, very soon, to discuss these issues.  lol

What makes you think they are poorly educated?  I don't know their educational history. 

We've gotten so good at abortion in this country that there aren't enough kids in orphanages left to adopt.  That's why couples go abroad. 

Yes, the kids have their own experiences - just like you and me.  And now they are going to experience family life.  I don't think these parents should be expected to preserver a culture they know nothing about.  They are simply trying to offer these kids a home. 

I do have one good adoption story to relate.  I was on a flight once and sat next to a woman that had adopted a child from Russia.  She was a very intelligent woman (a doctor) who specialized in pediatric brain disorders.  For whatever reason, she couldn't have kids of her own.  So she flew off to Russia (it was a horrible experience for her) and adopted a child from an orphanage and brought it here.  Guess what?  It turned out this child had the kind of brain disorder that she specialized in.  She had no idea this child had any medical problems before she adopted it.  She just wanted a child.  It turns out she was the best possible mother this kid could have gotten - one that was willing to help the child through its medical issues.

Makes you wonder about fate and higher powers and all that....or maybe it was just one very lucky child.

 

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"Hearts will never be practical until they can be made unbreakable."

Lets get one thing straight. I am sure that these people who are adopting the children and want to change the 4 and 8 year old's names are not doing it because it's a "selfless and noble act". Almost all people at least at some point in their lives want to have children. In America, the fad is to wait to have children for a long time to travel lots and work on your fancy career. The body does not work that way, so when a woman waits past 30-35 and often 40 to have a child, unless the $20,000+ fertility treatments work out, the only option left for the rich family is to adopt. So IMHO, when they adopt, they are doing so precisely because they were "selfish" earlier, and when they feel the need to change a person's name (especially an 8 year old's who has already developed an identity), that's even more selfish and is done most likely because they want their kid to be exactly like them, and indicates that they will probably attempt to mold the child(ren) their whole lives.

It's hard to call a child with the brain disorder lucky, but I understand your point. In the end, all that matters is love and care that families are willing to offer to the children. But ... I still think it's not enough. People in the US don't want to adopt American children not because the abortion rate is so high that there aren't any kids left to adopt, but because of many legal issues tied to the process of adoption that makes it flying to Russia and spending tens of thousands dollars look more doable than adopting in the U.S.

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"Some say the Muses are nine: how careless! Look, there's Sappho too, from Lesbos, the tenth." Plato

You sound angry at the people who have a 'fancy career'.  Why use "IMHO" when you are not humble at all - you are condescending.

These people do sound selfless.  I would never adopt other people's kids (call me part-Russian for that).

Unless you know these people, why slander them?

Your argument is pathetic.

 

 

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"Hearts will never be practical until they can be made unbreakable."

It is so wrong to assume that the only ones adopting out there are selfish couples who traveled and enjoyed their careers. There are actually people younger than 30-35 who can't have children for whatever reason, both men and women. And let me assure you that the reason some wait is not because of the burning desire to travel (and most americans haven't traveled much, not as extensively as many europeans like to travel), but most likely because they want to be able to provide for their family. From what I know adopting a child from Russia is very costly and very difficult when it comes to dealing with bureaucracy over there. The reasons I  think many opt for foreign adoptions are two:

1. Adoptive parents are spared the heartbreak of biological mother changing her mind. Often times adoptive parents would already bond with the child when birth mother appears with a change of heart. And there are couples who experienced this more than once.

2.  Those going to Eastern Europe may simply want a child that looks like them. Many caucasian parents would like a caucasian child. Those that don't necessarily care and fall under category 1 above adopt from China.

 

 

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Abortion IS high here.  Ridiculously high.  

If y'all want to be angry, be angry at the fact that people here are taking advantage of tough economic times in another country to go find a (white) child.  How come nobody has raised that issue? 

But from what I heard, going to Russia to adopt a child is a freakin' nightmare.  You have to be very desperate to go to those lengths - flying in to practically abandoned airstrips, in the middle of a winter that will kill you, to spend thousands of dollars on a baby that has horrible medical problems.  Geez - I can think of better things to do on my weekends.

From the Georgia Adoption web site: 

Children who are not readily available for adoption include:

• African American infants under the age of 1 with no physical, mental or emotional disabilities
• White or other minority children under the age of 8 with no physical, mental or emotional disabilities

 

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"Hearts will never be practical until they can be made unbreakable."

All of a sudden, Mr. James Bond became angry!!! Relax, have a glass of wine, and rejoice in not having to adopt ANY kids at all. :) At least, that's what I am doing! You may turn and twist this topic any way you like, but the bottom line remains the same - whatever people do is hardly ever out of noble aspirations but rather out of selfishness, and it's not a bad thing if it produces positive results. So, I raise my glass to our human nature! ;)

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"Some say the Muses are nine: how careless! Look, there's Sappho too, from Lesbos, the tenth." Plato